Are things as bad as they say they are, or only as bad as you think they are?

If you'd have me ?. I'm staying at folks most of the rest of the time, a night off from them may be good!

I hope you have a soft landing.

Glider, if the worst came to the worst and Mr Hole lost his job, we wouldn't have a budget to live within and would possibly lose our house. How do you solve that one, brains?

I think you get a lot of unnecessary stick on here, but sometimes you say the stupidest things.

Exactly what HH said. My H did get made redundant 2 weeks ago, I work very part time as I have a small child. He can claim £60 a week jobseekers allowance, we get no extra benefits etc as we earnt too much last year. We can pay the mortgage this month and probably next, but afer that, we're screwed. We've been thinking about selling our house to the council and then paying rent, at least that will be half the price of our mortgage. I am scared, very scared tbh.

Glider you tit, I'm not talking about having no money for shoes or having to buy own brand caviar - I'm talking about an income for a family of four dropping to £0.00 a week if my husband isn't working.

Please tell me how to live within those means, you idiot. God, I'm cross now. [head explodes]

What really pisses me off is that it wasn't so long ago that Glider was moaning about his own financial situation but very fortunately had the back up of parents who could supported his failed university education and help him get a job in his favourite industry. I think that cabin pressure affects his powers of reasoning.

I deal with hundreds of small businesses with the magazine, and it's been interesting to see who is closing their doors. In my experience, the majority are those who didn't do their business plans or - more significantly - those who received grant funding to start their businesses. Here, there was lots of funding for e-commerce a couple of years ago and many of those businesses who received it have stopped trading. Whether that's because they didn't have the know-how, the markteing budget (I think many saw it as a cheap way to open a shop without premises and though everyone would just magically find them when they were online) or whether it's because they weren't as committed as it wasn't their own money they were losing, I'm not sure. Also, a lot of the "hobby" small business owners are giving up (sounds a bit cruel, but those who weren't 100% committed to making a success of their business, and just seemed to do it to say they were running a business).

I've been lucky in that turnover from the magazine has increased edition on edition so far - although the amount of work needed to create that has risen dramatically. We're about to launch a new magazine to the public sector - one Local Authority has placed an order already, due to start in October. I am hoping that by spreading our earning capacity over the public and private sector we'll weather the storm a bit better. I bloody hope so, as we've just taken someone on.

In order to have a regular stream of income, I've taken on a part time job. This means that, if all else fails, my earnings will cover our PTers salary whilst she's establishing herself. However, I am going to have to be very ruthless if she doesn't perform as this is directly taking money out of our family pot, and I'm not looking forward to that TBH. It's a risk - but if we didn't take it, the business wouldn't grow.

Personally, we've been on a very tight lease for a year, but that's been a good thing. I have not earned any money in almost 3 and a half years as I was on maternity leave, then everything has been put into the business so far. We don't have any major debts (in both the business and our personal lives), which I have been very careful about. If all else fails I could go back to work full time - I am an experienced teacher so, hopefully, work should not be too directly affected. One of the reasons I opted for this job is because it's setting up a new qualification that all students will have access to in 2012 - and pretty much nobody has any knowledge or expertise at this point. I hope to create a good chance of niche work.

So, I guess, I am certainly very worried as I have taken lots of steps to protect us from any downturn.

I thought he had an A-level in critical thinking?...

I think a lot of us thought that when it was first mentioned ?

Glider, what were your A-levels? Over my many years as a hitcher, I'm sure I've heard you mention critical thinking, sports science and German. Seems an odd combination.

My sister did Home Ec, Classics and English KN, there are odder out there!

That doesn't seem that odd to me, NN ?

Reading my post to Glider back, it sounds as if I'm trying to imply something- I'm not at all, I'm just curious.

Methusala ?

Even i'm starting to worry about my job a bit. which sounds odd, as people are hardly likely to stop commiting crimes...

but i was on a division last night that i don't normally work, and the police sergeants were almost running the show...sending us messages to sent x unit to y job when we'd only had the job in minutes. i had one job that could be resolved by phone, and had typed the number on a log, but then did something else...when i called the bloke said that the sergeant had already called to resolve it (without bothering to tell us he was doing this) it's like they're keeping a dossier...'we did this without the control room, we sorted that without the control room' ☹️

plus the fact we're short staffed and we seem to be getting no trainees...

seems mad it appears they appear to be wanting to wind our job down, but wasted who knows how many thousands on uniforms for us

and on that cheery thought, i'm off to work ?

I think things are a combination of both. Financially things are quite grim at the moment but I also think the majority of the population are misinformed by the likes of the sun and GMTV etc. about the true state of affairs. (As an aside, I have given up watching GMTV as they mention the credit crunch about **** times a day and mostly in entirely the wrong context).

However, within certain industries, the current climate is very very damaging indeed. If you are a builder or mortgage broker or estate agent or anything to do with the housing industry, then things look like thet are going to be very bad for you, at least in the short term.

How bad things get are entirely a perspective issue. We are very very fortunate in that we are lucky enough to have some reasonable savings and these have been attracting a lovely interest rate for the last 6 months, whereas for years, we got the square root of nothing.

At the very top end of the financial spectrum, things do not seem to be too bad at all (thank everything for that). We have chartered Gin Palace for almost the remainder of the year, and she isn't even in service yet! Having said that, this is a mighty mighty relief as financing her and servicing our mortgage which will be reviewed in the early part of next year was not something we were looking forward to.

Oh, and Glider, brain first, speak second.

You can talk, grandpa.

Actually, Nick, did you really join in 2005? I'd always thought you'd been here far longer.

Don't you remember KN, that he left and rejoined because he got his party balloon?

Yep - he's a bigger gobshite than Cariad ?

wings actually.

KN, no, i joined in november 2003

Ah-ha, I do remember, yes.

Four years, sigh...I wonder whether Hitched will still be going in years to come? Will WP keep renewing itself while OT just gets older and older?

It is a nervous time for us. H is a contracts manager for a major housebuilder and has been in the construction industry since he graduated 13 years ago. We have a family and my income is half his. We are overpaying our mortgage at the moment in the hope to give us some breathing space should the worst happen, plus we have income protection but not to the full amount of H's salary.

He is pretty marketable in that he has managed alot of people and multi-million pound projects but he would have to go out of his direct experience to get another job and it is whether an employer would look at his CV when competition for jobs is so high.

We have good friends that are in the high end Jewellery business and it is not affecting them in ths slightest. It seems luxury goods are not affected.

I've just accepted a new job, which means we'll be moving soon and it means we will be renting somewhere rather than buying because of the current climate. We will be keeping our property here and trying to rent it out, so we're still 'on the ladder' but renting elsewhere for the time being.

Yesterday I had to tell 14 people that their jobs are at risk of redundancy and we've had another 5 people leave this year without being replaced. Generally people are taking on more work to fill the gaps as there is no money for new hires. The Company I currently work for is VC owned and they are getting very nervous about us spending money, hence the overhead cuts being proposed. We've cut our overhead costs by about £3m in the last 2 years through relocation and office closures, so goodness knows where we'd be if none of this had happened.

Luckily we are not massively affected at the moment, although energy bills are going up and our mortgage increases by £70 next month as our fixed rate came to an end and we've had to re-negotiate. I think things could be a lot worse for us and I know they still could go that way.

Ooh, me too. Let's be chilli twinnies.

G&T and I are pretty recession proof - sadly I know plenty that aren't.

Not quite time to stock up on tinned food and shotguns though.

Hmm.. Some interesting stuff just in the wee microcosm that is hitched....

It seems that yer actual 'wealthy' aren't feling things too much. (yet)

Yer genuinely skint aren't noticing that much either....

Ye 'Average Family' however.... Oh dear.

That was last night. We'll have to be lamb curry twinnies tonight ?

Likewise my job's fairly secure during a recession but Mrs Greenback's isn't and we would be pushed very hard if she were to lose her job.

Oh I'll be your curry twinnie.

Neither of us are recession secure. Him small business (although work picking up), me health and safety (often the first cut) WOHOO!

We're confident that we can ride things out sa we were careful when we moved to not saddle ourselves with a huge LTV on the mortgage and were able to put donw a large deposit as we had made a substantial profit on our old house. We have savings and the mortgage is the only debt.

I am a civil servant and am pretty secure in my job which pays well and has good benefits including a decent pension. I'm currently on a career break until the end of next year when I hope to return part time, childcare allowing.

Mr A has actually had a better year in terms of sweetie sales. He said that it was like this during the last downturn as well, people may not be spending on big luxures, but felt the need to treat themselves to chocolate or crisps. He's been in his job for 21 yrs now and again is fairly recession-proof. However, there has been something of a squeeze from suppliers and he's noticed people like Coke really pushing their product and pressuring individual outlets to stock their stuff over and above cheaper and/or local drinks. They've been heavily discounting and incentivising core ranges just to keep their brand as the main one in store.

I have noticed a substantial rise in the cost of certain foods. For example, four tins of chopped tomatoes (Napolina) was always £2.88 in Tesco. Usually there was a BOGOF offer. Last week, the price was £3.96. Things like yogurt, milk and cheese have all gone up a lot as well and it has impacted on how I shop. I've also noticed M&S recently discounting foodstuff and doing a lot more special offers, which they've not done as much of before. But every week now you can have a 3 for 2 bargain on most stuff that I buy regularly.

I do find it hard to sympathise with some people (I know some of them) who have for years used their house as a cure-all for getting what they want immediately and spending extravagantly on holidays, clothes, their kids, their homes etc. A good friend of mine has had her family to Thailand, Cuba, Dubai and Florida in the last three years, all on the CC, paid off by frequent re-mortgaging (propoerty here has gone through the roof, so the remortgage charges have been coverd by the equity increase). She's now panicing that she can't get a decent deal on a new mortgage and is having to find the extra to cover the CC bills which have increased with the opening of lots of shiny new designer shops in Belfast city centre from which her family just had to be Ted Baker and Timberlanded up to the eyeballs.

I hope it gets better for all the Hitchers directly effected. I know we're lucky and am grateful for it. I was shite with money in the past and learned a very hard lesson. It's not as easy as "sticking to your budget".

<forgets Glider is doubtless a finanacial whizz as well as an expert in everything else>

Another gem from the Glider. ?

We've not noticed a lot of the bads so far because we moved out of London and reduced rent etc radically without loss of income. But I'm sure we'll notice in the near future and we've got some way to go before we can claim to be financially secure.

I think there are some real "Marvins" out there who have a very negative outlook on life but no matter how positive your attitude, sh1t happens sadly.

In a way we are lucky as there was room for us to cut our spending and there still is so we were never right up to our limit, if that makes sense. Plus I have now taken on more freelance work, not because of the climate but because of an issue we had a few months back with H's business and that's worked in our favour. I am very scared of spending money though, I won't spend any money until I know I've got it covered by a job coming up. I've never been like that!

I "think" we are in ok industries, plus as we are self employed it kind of works in our favour if there are redundancies as people tend to use freelancers more. It's certainly happened that way for H as he's picked up new clients in the last couple of months.

We are used to it being very up and down and we've ridden out hard times before so I always think that we just get on with stuff and cope because we have to. I'm not a crying into my pillow kind of girl which I think helps.

Gosh, this thread grew legs! Some really interesting points made, and I think maybe I have been either protected from the worries or suffering from a case of Ostrich syndrome. I'm genuinely saddened that so many people are worried about their futures - I hope you ride it out.

I still think people shouldn't expect so much sunshine though - it's much less likely to disappoint and depress you if you expect rain and plan to make the most of it, honest ?

Don't mind the rain but would like it if the weather was a bit more predicatable.

Credit crunch - most people's misery has been caused by the perpetual scare mongering from the media. As long as people stay employed then it shouldn't be a catastrophe.

As long as you don't lose your job, can't find another one and lose the roof over your head I don't suppose you should be worrying about a spot of rain?

Did you bother to read this thread?