This JR/RB/Andrew Sachs thing

The BBC is reporting that she's far from pleased. Although they're reporting what the Sun says, so pinch of salt needed. Anyway:

I really don't agree with this. While it does not justify what was said, who to, why it was broadcast... it does set a some of what was said into context. I'm not at all saying AS/gd should expect such comments. This doesn't make it any more pleasant for AS to hear - I completely understand why he is upset about it (not really understanding why JR/RB thought it was appropriate to leave the message) and offended. I do think though it is relevant to a listener who without this information could think the comments were even more off the wall than with context they were.

When I heard they saying about the swing for example, the picture I had in my head of AS's granddaughter was more a child so I think it was more shocking because of that - had I known she was a burlesque dancer at the time I might have found it less potentially offensive.

Of course her being a burlesque dancer does not make it any less upsetting for her. Had it all been kept unbroadcast AS would still have been upset but it could have been sorted out much easier and saved the granddaughter from further embarassment. As it was played out and further publicised it has made the whole thing worse. However I do still think in the whole scheme of things it is less likely to harm her career/reputation than if she were a teacher/nun etc etc. That doesn't mean it's any easier for the family to deal with though.

Not sure if I'm making sense, it's a bit early ?

She's milking this for all the publicity it's worth so I have zero respect for her opinion now (complete with staged vaguely provocative pictures in today's Sun). I have a feeling that this whole story is revenge at the BBC from the right wing media for giving so much prominence to the Osbourne yacht story.

Im sick of the whole friggin thing now.

Quite. LP your turn of phrase makes me want to heave.

I fail to see how this can possibly remain 'about Andrew Sachs' when the media has built up into a ridiculous great frenzy and the grand daughter is calling for RB and JR to resign. AS has stated he would like the whole thing to be dropped, meanwhile the grand daughter is giving interviews to The Sun. While I have a modicum of sympathy for him I have absolutely none for her.
Also, this is not just any person, this is a man who has worked in broadcasting for a bloody long time - I find it highly unlikely he found that answerphone message to be all that shocking - two 'comedians' leave a message and you assume it to be the truth? He may find it distasteful, but he is only old, not bloody stupid.
And comparing it to your own family member hearing such a message is daft. Unless you happen to be as high profile as those involved.

L
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As I mentioned before, it's really not relevant what her job is as this involved her grandfather. When she arrives at his house, she won't be dressed as a 'satanic slut', she'll just be his average 26 year old granddaughter. She won't sit having tea with him saying "so grandpa, did you see my latest photo shoot, I look like such a satanic slut. Have your heard of Russell Brand? I shagged him last night, he was rather good and certainly up for everything I wanted to do to him", she'll just be the Georgina he's always known.

It's all such a mess.

And whilst I'm on media related conspiracy theories

Piers Morgan calls for JR to be sacked

Piers Morgan's chat show goes head to head with Ross

? No alterier motive there then?

What on earth has THAT got to do with it? It's about AS being offended as he is undoubtedly entitled to be.

I can't remember hearing about a "prank" of this nature. Yes there's been prank calls etc but I don't recall hearing anything of this nature. The fact is AS is the innocent victim in all of this. He didn't ask for these 2 to call him, and I am sure he certainly didn't ask the BBC to broadcast it.

As for GB's involvement yes I agree it is OTT but at the end of the day the BBC is not a private company it is a public organisation funded by licence payers money so it's not like it's a complete irrelevance.

I don't think JR and RB should lose their jobs however much as I am not a fan of RB and think he's a complete pillock. I don't think they are the main "guilty" parties in the whole sorry episode. This kind of stunt is par from the course from them. The "blame" lies with whoever saw fit to broadcast the calls.

What if the Georgina he has always known was a rampant trollop? Would that make a difference? We don't know how he knows her, do we? It's all conjecture

L
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When I say always known, I mean as a child. I'd hope she wasn't a rampant trollop then. ?

AS comes across as fairly straight laced and while he may know all about her job, I can't see him discussing her sex life with her tbh. Blimey, my granny was very open about such things but I still wouldn't have discussed my own sex life with her! ?

ETA, my last point isn't in a "my mother is 70 and wouldn't be offended so AS shouldn't be either" kind of way.Just a personal, horified thought at my granny knowing about such things. ?

What I cannot understand is why AS would get these messages and think 'RB and JR leaving supposedly amusing messages? Well, that must be true then'. It is so very unlikely. I can see how he would be offended, but to automatically jump to the conclusion that it was the truth? Why would he?
This is so madly overblown that I have a new conspiracy theory : this whole thing has been cooked up by the bbc to garner publicity. Or maybe JR has had a better offer and wants out of his contract, and RB wants to promote his new show? The more it trundles on, the more interviews in the sun and outrage, the less believable I find any of it

L
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Whatever happens the BBC aren't going to sack Ross and Brand on the basis of a Daily Mail campaign (Brown sensing right wing votes hence him wading into the argument?) Ross is too valuable to leave to commercial TV and Brand is useful for Radio 2's demographic. This will blow over, despite this utterly ridiculous attempt for the Mail to prolong the story:

The Brand and Ross episode is certainly not a single low point in tasteless broadcasting by the BBC.

One complaint from a random Scottish bloke ?

Dog rape ?

Even better are the comments on the DM's website:

"Well said...I stopped listening to the Radio on Saturday mornings long ago because of his inane and disgusting chatter."

Poor dear, perhaps her dial was stuck? ?

They wouldn't have to be telling the truth for him to be offended though. Surely someone saying such things about your granddaughter, even if they aren't true, is offensive? Having a message like that would be just as hurtful as lies as it is as truth? He would surely know it had to be true, why would they make a random thing up like this?

I do agree it has gone completely over the top now and needs to be put to bed but I do take exception to any point claiming AS is anything other than the victim in this.

I am not suggesting AS wouldn't be offended, but it seems to have been taken as read that it was true.

As for why would they make a random thing up, erm...isn't that what RB does? Constantly? He talks utter bollocks, constantly. Which makes it even more unlikely you'd take anything with more than a hefty pinch of salt. Same goes for JR really. He oftne refers to having shagged people on his Friday night show. Actually, I think the whole thing could have been better ended by AS calling the show and saying 'sorry I couldn't make the interview, I was shagging Jonathan's wife'

L
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Jaz, i m still not understanding why her life, her job, or what she does in her personal life is in any way relevant. the issue is that AS is offended, and the "jokes" were tasteless. i think far worse than " i shagged your granddaughter" is the comment about hanging himself due to the shame of the publicity. whilst i agree with KN that the bbc needs to be edgy, this is far from edgy, its just offensive, and not in the least bit funny.

the bbc have handled it incredibly badly, as per usual. i m a big fan of the bbc, but when it comes to broadcasting problems, they do tend to get it horribly wrong at the resolution stage.

AS is unlikely to know this though, I doubt he is RBs demographic. I can't imagine many people of his generation know much about RB and although they will know JR, they probably don't watch his show.

I think this has been blown way out of proportion by the Daily Mail. I'm not sure why so many politicians are talking about it - it's even been discussed in the Commons...

AS is nothing but a victim in this, and whatever her job or public image, GB is as worthy of respect as any other person.

you can be sure that if there is a bandwagon rolling, politicians will jump on to it. its wholly innapropriate that brown and "call me dave" have both commented in my view.

i also fail to see what her job has to do with it either. ok, her job/lifestyle may be a bit alternative, it still doesn't mean she's fair game to have her private/sex life broadcast to the nation.

as i said before, how would JR like it if some 'celeb' said they'd shagged one of his daughters on the radio? (when they're old enough, of course) whatever his daughters did for a living, he'd still be angry their privacy was invaded that way.

Good to see the "aspiring actress" Voluptua maintaining a dignified position by appearing on the front of yesterdays NOTW in a tacky Ann Summers number.

Classy.

I'm sure none of this is doing her "career" any harm.

I am pretty sure he knows JR, and has been interviewed by him a few times. I am not making assumptions about how aware he is of RB. I mean, my MIL is 75 and knows of him.

L
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I said they would know who JR is. ?

Just to point out that the transcript of the conversation states the only reference to suicide was one throwaway line

Sachs: [his answer machine message] Sorry I can't answer at the moment …

Brand: [interrupting] … I am too busy thinking about killing myself … Andrew, this is Russell Brand. I am so sorry about the last message - it was part of the radio show, it was a mistake … The truth is I am phoning you to ask if I can marry - that's right, marry - Georgina the granddaughter.

Nothing at all about hanging himself owing to the shame of it all etc. That's being greatly exaggerated in some sections of the press.

I do totally agree with your last statement however. I am a huge fan of the BBC, I think they are the best public broadcaster in the world, but they are sometimes awfully ill advised. For the record I'm not suggesting that the BBC should become staid and boring, far from it, but I think there is an interesting debate to be had on the subject of how far is too far for a public broadcaster. Personally I'd like to see removal of censorship after 10pm at night, and more personal/parental responsibility on what one views/reads - but I know that's not an achievable goal. I also like to see the BBC pushing the boundaries, but given that the BBC is funded in greater part by the people, is this appropriate? I don't know the answer, and I can see two sides.

This whole thing is getting way out of hand. Gordon Brown? Jeez!

In the cold light of day I can see that AS could be just an elderly man who is hurt, confused and upset about the jibes being aimed at his granddaughter. Fair enough. However, as Lois said I believe, he is also an extremely seasoned performer, and half my lifetime spent in and around 'showbusiness' (God I hate that word, but in this case I can't think of a better one) in many different forms, and the people who populate it, has made me horribly cynical.

Yes, and you also said he probably doesn't watch his show. Why wouldn't he? he has been on it, he could be a massive fan. He may have been to Russel Brand's for tea. Who are we to assume otherwise? The point I am making is that this thread is full of conjecture about what AS is/isn't like, how upset he is/isn't and that is all, essentially, made up to suit each person's different opinion on what has happened.

L
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The pair have been suspended.

Ugh. What a stupid overblown story this has turned into. I hate the press.

IMO her job does not jusitfy any of it but it does help explain some of the comments made. That doesn't mean AS need be less offended but I do think if some listeners/people who later complained had known the background to some of the references they would have been less likely to complain.

It is bound to be more offensive to call someone a satanic slut who is not in a group called the satanic sluts (from GB's/AS's (if he knew she was in the group)/a general listener is it not?

Agreed.

Decent article in the Graun

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2008/oct/29/russell-brand-jonathan-ross