Use of racist terms unintentionally/racism generally

This exactly describes what my MIL and FIL say - and no, I haven't corrected them. I spoke to OH (as thought maybe he should) but he didn't want to.

It makes me uncomfortable but they have just missed the shift over to when this stopped being the 'correct' term.

I feel that different areas of the country are more race tolerant than others. When I lived in Hampshire I was very shocked at phrases etc being used in a workplace!

I tend to guffaw and repeat their word in an incredulous voice. And then say, you can't say that anymore. It is mostly my Dad I have this to contend with, but that is exactly how I've reacted when it's other people. I think.

I have no idea at all about racism in the rest of the country because my age group / friends and this city are not prone to isms like this, probably a bit of a bubble, but there it is, a happy bubble.

I have corrected my MIl who frequently says darkie- I don't undersatdn why she actually has to say it (Its not, Jane, you know the darkie from Hertford, its just- look at the darkie on the telly) so I assume its racism.

I don't understand why they don't say black, it seems the more obvious word, but maybe thats my age.

I think I may have metnioned to this person about darkie before and she now says, for example' that dark gentleman' in an effort to be polite. I find it really hard to say nothing, but I know she is going to be massively offended if I mention it becasue she is genuinely trying to be polite

L
xx

I used to correct my mother when she said coloured, meaning black, but she can remember when it wasn't acceptable to say black, and was at a bit of a loss as to what term she was supposed to use. I had the same problem when I was growing up, as I was punished for saying 'coloured' at school, but told off for saying 'black' at home.

She also thinks the political correctness thing is a bit ridiculous, and thinks that as long as you don't refer to black people with 'the n word' you're not actually being offensive and any people who complain are being precious, so any attempts to get her to change the terms she uses are doomed to failure.

I think I'd mention it. My dad says this, with his logic that not all 'coloureds' are black, they're brown. He thinks of 'Darkie' as a sort of colloquialism. I've managed to wean him off JewBoy and Wop but he still says Chi nk. Oddly enough, he would rather die than be called racist and has Jewish and black friends, and a mixed race grandchild on the way....Small steps....

ETA - hitched just edited my post to auto delete ch1nk! How peculiar!

Funnilly enough an old friend of mine came round for coffee the other day and was talking about a "coloured" man. I told her you can't say that, to which she corrected herself, ok then "half-caste" again I said you can't say that. It's black or mixed race. She thought saying black would be seen as racist.

So yes, I do correct people.

If it was my mum or dad (and it would be, they are dreadful about using racist language), I'd say "Mum!!!! You can't say that!", bbut if it was anyone else I think I'd keep quiet.

It would also depend on whether they're using racist language because they're racists, or because they're trying to be "correct" and aren't aware that acceptable terminology has changed. If the latter I might say "You have to call them blacks now, you know, Auntie Mabel." ?

We were serving coffee after church last year when we overheard one of the congregation using the phrase "*** in the woodpile". She obviously noticed our shocked faces, and realised what she had said, but instead of apologising, gave us a rant about people being too PC.

And she's an educated, middle-class churchgoer.

The problem is I didn’t know that it was wrong to say half cast the other day, I didn’t know that it wasn’t PC and was informed that you must say mixed raced. When said half cast, I didn’t know it wasn’t PC anymore, so I think sometimes like me, people don’t mean it in a horrible way.

MD – You mention that there was a “shift over” what do you mean by that? How do people know when the changeover was, or how do you know when they happen or how they happen?

I work with Asians that say that this country as gone too PC, and even admit that they can say things that aren’t PC, and they know they will get away with it because of their race, but they admitted that if I said it (I am white) I would be pulled over on it.

The thing is, how are you supposed to know that terms are no longer used/acceptable? It's not as if there's a handbook issued. Terms that our parents would have used are not considered racist but would they know? I worry about this sometimes, kind of like with "little people" what's the acceptable term to use these days, it changes all the time and I can't keep up so I'm sure I'd offend someone at at some point.

But why does the view of a minority on Pc-ness become any more valid than anyone elses opinion on it? Its like my FIL, he said the other day something about looney bins and I mentioned that wasn't too nice and he said "I know someone who has been in one who calls it a looney bin" well, who cares what his mate thinks? having been in one doesn't mean he gets to decide whats offensive.

I don't understand what people are getting at when they say thinsg like "well, my Indian friends say P***" so what?

At my friend's school there's a teacher who gets paid an increment to support minority groups, kids with special needs, etc, and in a meeting recently, she rather blotted her copybook by saying she was fed up of "working like a black."??

I must admit to being unclear on retard, it sounds so cruel but is often used on TV and in films-

Thats how I'd keep up with Pcness TBH- If they say it on tv (normal TV, not nazis at night or anything) it must be OK

My accountant who is also a middle-class church goer used this phrase - I was really shocked.

Erm, I have to say, and sorry for being dim, but since when was it racist to say (for example) 'That coloured gentleman' ? i say that about a chap I have seen at work, he is not black, more caramel colouring, and is totally gorgeous by the way. I refer to him as being coloured...........

My Nan used to say 'coloured' and I used to correct her. So yes I do. However I think people aren't sure what to say anymore as what's politically correct is always changing.

My boyfriend is black and I have come across quite a few people who have been scared to say the word black. I was in Boots changing my digital photos on one of their machines and my Mum said M isn't that black you need to change the light. The woman helping us nearly fell over from what my Mum had said.

I mean that when she was younger to say black was incorrect and the term to use was coloured. They live abroad a lot, so she misses the changes in 'correct' terminology and would be mortified if she accidentally offended anyone.

I think 'Coloured' came to light as a fairly perjorative (sp?) term used in south africa for mixed race people, 'Cape coloured' I think it was. And they were labeled thus and seen as second class citizens by everyone. I may have that wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's what I've gleaned from conversations with South Africans.

My mum always refers to black people as 'coloured'. Every time I correct her and yet she still uses it, drives me potty.

Who decides what's PC and what's not anyway? I remember someone saying on here that people who look of indian origin don't like to be called 'asian' and yet H's mate who's parents are indian says he likes to be referred to as 'asian'. It's hard work.

It's a difficult one and I have been guilty of saying coloured in the past, instead of black as I thought black was no longer acceptable.

We had some race awareness at work recently and they said that mixed-race is also out of favour now as dual/mixed/multi heritage is preferred.

To be honest, the training raised more questions than it answered!

and I have asian friends that only like to be referred to as black

MD - I agree re Hampshire - if only because my MiL lives there (Romsey) and she is the most shocking old (84) bigot.

Yesterday, she remarked that Obama had "done very well for himself for a darkie" ?

Lois - I think it is a generational thing, mixed in with a touch of regional lack of awareness. I think people who, for instance, live in major urban communities, are more used to living with a wider variety of neighbours and colleagues and so have a better sense of what an ethnically mixed environment can feel like. When I visit my mum in Norfolk, I rarely see a face that isn't Caucasian, unlike here in London.

I also think that the US is a curious mix of being very PC about race matters, mixed in with also being very separate in many areas: housing, dating, music, to name but three aspects of life where I have observed a lot of polarisation.

When I was at Uni, an American girl lived in the same accomodations as me. She asked me once what we called black people in the UK, as she didn't want to offend anyone. I was surprised that she had to ask, until she pointed out that in America she'd normally say 'Black-Americans', but that she realised this wasn't appropriate as in the UK very few of the black people she saw would be American.

Hyacinth I often wonder about mental illness / handicapped / disabled / retarted. What can be used what can't?

I caught eldest SD joking with her friends the other day. Apparently the new thing in school is to call people a bit "Jean Slater" (from Eastenders) if they are a bit well you know, whoop whoop! I had to walk away I was laughing so much. It's wrong to laugh I know but the way they were talking....

You are wrong.

In the "Old South Africa", one was racially categorised as black, white, coloured or Indian. (Chinese people counted as Indian I think; Japanese were white for some obscure reason!). Obviously the system stank, but the word "coloured" is no more loaded than "black" or "white". The largest population of colorued people is in the Western Cape, hence "Cape Coloured" - they're also quite a distinct community, with their own manners, accent, beliefs etc.

PMSL though at Sparks thinking it's acceptable here to say "coloured" - it's not ? I think the terms was used in America to describe black people, and is now considered very dismissive, disrespectful and pejorative. I guess the "correct" word to use is decided by the ethnic groups themselves.

? Well you learn something new each day. Ive now be re catagorised lovely.?

That makes me puke!!!! I also hate Bi-racial

AFAIK, it is perfectly OK to use phrases like mental illness, and to refer to people as having a physical or learning disability.

However, I'm pretty sure "retard" is offensive, as are "loony" and "schizo". I'm not sure TV is always a good guide as to how to address our fellow men (or women)

"Handicapped" is also unasseppable aafaik.

I remember getting told off on here for referring to BB Darnell as an "albino" - apparently the term to use is "person with albinism". Who knew? ?

I think that it is a bit of a minefield and I suspect even more so for the older generation.

FWIW I think that if there were an older relative saying "coloured" in respectful terms, believing that they were using an acceptable term, I might say "apparently these days the best term is X*"

If they were using it in an abusive way then that's different and I would give them a stern talking to.

My mother has horribly racist moments. Oddly she never is towards individuals, just uses very un-PC words for groups in general. Same with homophobia - she shakes her head about people being gay in general but for individuals she doesn't give a stuff. Odd.

*I've put X because tbh I'm never sure what the right term is - I suspect it's to use Afro-Caribbean, African-American, South-East Asian etc but I generally try to avoid it altogether

That's ridiculous surely?

It's like calling someone blind.... Nooo, they are a person who is blind- WTF?? They are blind surely?

Thank you for correcting me on calling someone 'coloured' I really didn't know it was 'wrong'.

KB3 - Retarted? Is that when you are divorced or leave a convent?! ?

Seriously, I would stick to disabled and mental illness/mentally ill.

I think handicapped and retarded are very old fashioned and considered offensive terms in the UK now whereas they are still commonly used in the USA.

I'm a medical writer and we try and say where possible patients with schizophrenia or schizophrenia patients, rather than schizophrenic, ditto for diabetes, mania, and so on. It's always patients with a condition, IYSWIM.

I know some people find this "PC" but I think it does make sense.