Taking children to 'grown up' events?

My friends know better than to bring their children to my house ?

Our girly nights are normally held at a child-free house so those with kids can have a night away from them. If it is at one of their houses, the kids are out of the way.

I wouldnt be comfortable with that either!

We have taken L to the odd party and dinner party (he's 19 weeks old) as he has been able to be popped in his basket, asleep, and we have been able to get on with things. He's always been invited though as he was so small and as he gets bigger we'll get a babysitter.

I wouldn't like that either. [aside] I've been to NYE hotel formal night things and surprisingly enjoyed it but it could have been a disaster ?

I was an only child for years and probably got dragged along to things that weren't appropriate or where I wasnt particularly welcome as I spent a lot of time with my parents and they didn't like to do things without me but I don't intend doing the same with my children (if ever I have any)

I understand it' to which tricky for her - she is a single parent, the childs father lives in another city and her parents don't live in the country but she does have sisters who live in our town who she could call upon but chooses not or friends who could babysit. We usually have nights in at hers because of the child but he'll be out playing (in summer) or later on in bed etc. It came up this week that did we want to go to someone elses house and said surely we can't because K will have the child to which K responded of course we could go to someone elses house as she could bring child with her? I didn't take too well to that idea as it puts a different spin on things and she got a bit huffy saying it's not like we "eff and blind" and that the child was used to being round her friends and whats the difference to us coming to her house as child would be there anyway?? I said there is a difference because at someone elses house child is well and truely stuck in the same room as us, at his own house it's different?

This is the same friend who I posted about a while ago who brought him to a friends baby shower.

I am a bit barr humbug when it comes to kids though so wasn't sure if I was just being OTT.

It depends on the context I suppose. A tiny baby sleeping in a basket at a dinner party is differI wouldn't dream of taking my kids to a girlie night. I don't really like being adult events when kids are running about and I tend to actively moderate my behaviour.

My friend was planing on bringing her 6 week baby to MrA's recent birthday party held at our house. We hadn't invited the baby, had expressly told her that our kids would be away and it would have been entirely inappropriate. In the end, she didn't come at all as she was knackered, but I was surprised when she'd mentioned bringing him at all.

I don't have friends with children. I say goodbye at the baby shower and arrange to see them again in 18 years time!! ?

Seriously, it would annoy me greatly and I think I would make excuses not to attend something if I knew an "inappropriate" child would be there. It would irritate me too much and I would prefer not to offend the mother by sighing and rolling my eyes continuously.

I totally agree with you, there is a time and a place for children. I rang another hotel up and although they said the children were allowed to come, they would be the only ones there. The idea that my children would be the only one there really doesn't sit right with me. As others have pointed out it's not fair to enforce my children on others if they think they are attending an 'adult only' event. There is a time and place for children to attend formal events and I guess in many peoples eyes NYE isn't one of them.

I wouldn't bring a child to a girly type night, no. There will no doubt be conversations going on that are for adults only.

The hotel issue is different, though; I think well behaved children sgould be welcome at these types of events. I have read more than one article recently about the link between childhood behavioural issues and being excluded from the 'adult' world (parents eating separately, having friends over and shutting children out of the room, only being taken to 'childish' restaurants rather than more 'adult' ones etc - I think it refers to these things being the norm and happening regularly rather than isolated incidents). I do think there is something in it - I remember being acutely upset at my mother choosing to spend time with her friends when I had very little time with her, and I see the same distress in my niece. One article discussed the current problems with youth in this country and linked them directly with young people being socially excluded from adults - they don't eat with them, they don't go out with them etc. (I'm not criticising anyone's parenting here, btw - just relaying what the article had to say. It was far more eloquent than me!).

I don't think that all events should be friendly, but I think a fair few more should be.

I don't take my children anywhere past 7pm but then I'm talking from the standpoint of a) my children being 1 and 4, b) believing a bedtime routine is essential and c) having a partner and babysitting available which affords me the choice.

Maybe as a single mother she feels she alreadys asks a lot of her sitsters/family and doesn't feel she wants to impose on them any more than she already does?

If parents chose to bring children to inappropriate events then that's one thing (which I don't agree with) but if they're doing it because it's that or never go out, then that deserves more sympathy than you're showing, tbh.

I'm possibly being defenseive as a friend has just had her husband walk out on her, and I have never appreciated how hard single parenthood is before seeing her struggle on a daily basis with the situation she finds herself in. Walk a mile in someone's shoes, and all that.

When they doled out maternal instinct, were you standing with me in the queue for chocolate instead? ?

See, a tiny baby in my eyes would always be acceptable because I wouldn't expect the mother to leave them behind at such a young age.

I'm generally against children attending adult events as it does definitely make it a different event. Our 2 year old has been invited to a wedding next weekend with us but we're leaving him with Granny as we both think the table would be better without a toddler there, adorable though he is, it's just not the same with small children there.

WSS. I have to say that I would expect that a mum with a six week old came as a package. I know that if I had a baby that young and was invited somewhere and told my baby couldn't come, I wouldn't be going. Obviously, I totally understand why people want child free events and I am supportive of that, the only thing I get irritated about is when someone refuses an invite because they have a really young baby and are judged for that.

As a Mother i would never want to take my kids to those type of events or get togethers. if it's a case of not having a babysitter i would have to face that fact i couldn't attend.

Me too. Tiny babies, maybe, depending on the event, but once they're at moving stage or have a set bedtime, then no. I do understand it can be hard for her, but you've all been trying to take her needs into account.

I too would take a 6 week old with me, and did - they have no impact on anyone else, they're just sleepy bundles or if they're crying most people would take them off to a bedroom or whatever.

I'm with you though, a 10 year old boy at a girly night. Well, you should call her bluff and behave as normal in front of him, then she can make a choice for next time.

Really? I wouldn't have dreamt of taking any of my kids to a house party at that age unless they were specifically invited. I think that a dinner party is different as the baby can sleep whilst the adults eat in what is usually a more sedate evening, but at a house party where there's mainly drinking, chatting, music and so on is a toally different vibe and I think a baby there changes that significantly.

As I said, my kids (9, 1 & 1) weren't there, but maybe I have been hard on her. Her and her h had been out without him before then.

Ironically, she didn't invite kids (including my son) to her wedding as it was an "adult affair".

That does put a slightly different slant on it ma, so sorry about that. I wouldn't take a six week old to a house party, not even sure if I would be up to it by that stage anyway. I don't have kiddies yet myself, but my general understanding is that the majority of mums would find it very hard to leave a six week old, especially if they were breast feeding and still trying to establish supply. Had both of them been out without baby before then, or just one of them?

Just trying to give a different slant on why someone with a baby that young might expect to take them along, obviously, there will always be exceptions to the rule. However, I wouldn't be taking a child above a year or so unless they were invited. I just think it's different with very young babies.

Perhaps I have the incredible sleeping baby but he's been to house parties, birthday parties, birthday weekends away etc etc etc and slept through them all. In fact most people haven't even known he was there. He has even managed to sleep through drunken guitar playing and kareoke. I have been sober on all occasions and have left/gone to bed early and have had no problem. I wouldnt have assumed he was welcome and would have either declined the invite or made babystting arrangements if he hadn't been invited. Now he's getting a bit older we'll do things differently for his sake as much as the adults.

I feel sorry for the 10 yr old boy who is going to have to sit among a group of women all night. Poor thing.

Yup, they'd been out as a couple without him.

I was a single parent for many years and was lucky like HB's friend to have accomodating friends and family, but sometimes I had to refuse invitations as I simply had no babysitter, or he was ill, or he just didn't want me to go. One of the things about having children, whether part of a couple or not, your social life changes almost unexpectedly and it sometimes comes as a surprise that you can't do what you want or what was so easy before.

That sounds trite and smug, but I think maybe some people (like my friend) forget that their baby isn't at the centre of everyone's plans in the same way he is at theirs.

Don't get me wrong though, he's been to other child-friendly events we've had and he's always welcome during the day - he's adorable and I've marked im down as a suitable boyfriend for either of my twins?.

I agree that there's a time and place to inflict your children on someone. I hosted a baby shower for a friend and one girl brought her 7 yr old son with out seeing if it was ok first - and although it was fine really, it def did change the nature of the chatter - i mean you can hardly compare birth stories and pregnancy symptoms in front of a little boy without traumatising him!

On the other hand, i think it's important to take kids to grown up places - i remember taking my brothers to see a shakespeare play (i think it was "A Winter's Tale") at the RST in stratford when they were 3 and 4. They were spellbound and the youngest asked me in the middle of the play what 'melancholy' meant - which was remarkable and showed the extent to which he was following it. I know other parents who wouldn't DARE take their 10 yr olds to the theatre because they don't think they could cope / behave / concentrate / whatever - i think unless you put them in situations where you expect them to cope etc, they'll never learn to!

I was brought up being taken everywhere - i mean not unsuitable places or places i wouldn;t be welcome - but certainly to nice restaurants and grown up dinners and tea parties and plays etc. However, i wasn't a brat and my mother had an all-controlling warning glare!! ?

PS - i would also assume that a mother and newborn would come as package - and wouldn't expect the baby to be left behind at my request. I took Fin everywhere when he was completely portable - I was directing the school production from when he was 2 weeks old, and he came with me to that as well! (not any more though - he's far too mischievous!)

How would you phrase it to her that its not suitable to bring the child? I have tried saying 'its not appropriate' or that it puts a different spin on things if he is there and I am met with a response of "he's used to being around my friends" or the like. I can't seem to get it across to her that alters things?

I can't believe you said that. You really don't think I have any maternal instinct? You've really offended me now. Of course I wasnt in the queue for chocolate.

I was too busy queueing for vodka. ???

We are now often in similar situations as is in our usual group of friends there are now 7 kids of 4 sets of parents. If we go to restaurants they all get sitters, or only 1 parents comes, but round our houses now it's kind of expected that the kids are invited but it's starting to get a bit much now there's so many of them. It's come to the point now that we just don't want to invite them over so end up socialising more with the non parents adults.

We wanted our wedding to be child free, ended up with two 6 week olds as they clearly couldn't be left behind and they were no bother but some photos have a pram in which wasn't spotted on the day (photographer or parent should have done in my eyes) and it still annoys me now!

We are taking our toddler to a Hogmanay thing this year. It will probably be the last as I am dreading it as she is wild.

However, the hotel we are going to splits it in two. There is a family event, geared towards children, and a Gala Ball (adults only - and where I am craving to be ?) They said the family do is sold out, though it isnt a large room. And at least everyone will be expecting there to be children.

I am regretting it though. If I hadnt paid a hefty deposit early on in the year before I knew what toddlers were really like then I certainly wouldnt be booking it. I am having visions of 5 hours of screaming toddlers, bored older children, and nothing but childrens music. ?

However, the alternative is staying in listening to our neighbour fall out with all the other neighbours one by one as we gets louder and more aggressive (its scary even through the walls)

Edited to add: I wouldnt take her to house parties or anything else like that. My friends had a party last year and two of the couples brought their babies (one probably ages with mine). I didnt, I left mine at home with her dad and I replaced the nappies in my bag with 2 bottles of wine ?. However, I couldnt relax as there were young children there, I just felt it changed the dynamics of the night a bit. Though, I suppose it wasnt necessarily for the worse.

I would consider it frankly odd that someone would want to take a 10yr old boy on a girly night in. I would, as a group of friends, understand that it would be tricky to come/better to go to her house.

I have come across parents who treat their children like their best friends - now this is lovely to a degree, but sometimes they don't quite seem to see their best pal is also a child and it's not always appropritae for them to attend things. I am not explaining this well - it is like the parent wants their bond with their child to be something above the parent/child bond and the line between friends/children gets a bit blurred for them.

It's possible this is generaklky absolutely fine, but sometimes it seems like their smothering their child with wanting them to be included in absolutely everything when sometimes it's not appropriate for either the child or the other guests.

I am hoping someone else will have come across this and gets what I am on about.

I would think tiny babies can go anywhere - you can swear in front of them, right?

L
xx

We have a sall group of friends and only one couple has a child who is about 9.5 months old. He has been to almost everything going since he was born - bbq's, drunken parties, night out at restaraunts etc. I think the only time they haven't been out with us was when we went to the cinema but then to include them we went to the family showings a couple of times. I know he's very young now but I don't know at what point he won't come along - he's sort of become part of the group now ?

Oh yes. Though not if you read that supermarket parking thread the other day ?

We took our son to a few "grown up" nights out when he was small and "portable" - he'd usually spend the night asleep in his carrycot.

There's no way I'd consider taking him or my daughter on a girlie night in, that would be wrongity wrong in sooooo many ways. I know it can be hard to find babysitters but I'd rather not go than take either of them with me to something like that.

THis is a good point actually, because if lots of parents think you have to moderate your language in front of tiny babies, then it isn't appropriate to take them along to grown up events

L
xx

We were talking about this last weekend. We went out to a tapas restuarant with a table booked for 8pm. When we got there we were sat next to a family with 3 youngish children (at a guess 2, 4 and 6) who stayed there until gone 9pm. We had left our baby at home (with my Mum, not on her own?) and I wouldn't have dreamed of having her there but tbh that is more to do with not having her out that late than the restaurant. Also there were a number of groups of Christmas parties with people already plastered at them so I don't think I would have wanted G around that.

Having said that we have take her out to restaurants at lunchtime but I tend to think that is more acceptable as a family / child friendly occasion than dinner, again because of bedtime. She behaved extremely well and loved the Thai food that was served and kept giggling at the waiters, so it went well but still wouldn't convince me to take her out in the evening.

As to a 10 year old boy at a girlie night, I imagine it wasn't too much for him either so I think I would prefer not to inflict it on him or the other people at the girlie night!

I don't mind children being in restaurants for dinner, as long as they're well behaved and not ragged because they should be in bed.

Lois - when they're tiny, babies don't really take anything in or do anything. I'm also a firm believer that by taking babies along with you whatever you're doing, they learn *but* this has to be within the framework of not inconveniencing other people.

But if lots of parents think that children shouldn't be sworn in front of, for example, then that means lots of epople generally must think it - which means that they would modify their behaviour becasue children were around, or the paretns would have an expectation of people modifying their behaviour. In which case, should the children not be taken?

L
xx