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Daffy B

Do you have a religion/faith/belief system?

Daffy B, 5 August, 2009 at 11:36 Posted on Off Topic Posts 0 31

When I was younger I was quite interested in the supernatural, afterlife, pondering about whether there was a God and all that type of thing. For a short time I considered myself a spiritualist and then completely lost faith in everything, decided I didn't believe in anything and would find out when I die if there was anything "after". I don't know if this is weird but I do occasionally worry that there is a heaven/hell and that I'm going to live forever and I really don't think I like the sound of that. I once stopped myself from committing suicide because I didn't want to end up in hell or have to justify myself to God, although most of the time I say I don't believe in anything. My brother committed suicide and I worry sometimes that he is in hell. I do think that I turn to religion when I'm feeling unhappy because I seem to have a need when I'm down that there is something "more" and to be part of a group.

So, that turned in to a bit of a ramble but I guess what I wanted is to hear your viewpoints. Do you have a religion? Have you any faith in anything that isn't science/Darwin based? How did you come to your beliefs? Have you ever completely changed your mind about something, such as brought up Catholic and then went atheist or vice versa?

31 replies

Latest activity by CBear, 5 August, 2009 at 16:18
  • The Beast
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    The Beast ·
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    I'm sorry about your brother. ?

    To answer your question, nope, I have no deistic faith whatsoever. I was brought up without religion, aside from the usual hymn practice/harvest festivals at school, (I was never Christened), and have never come even close to doubting my disbelief. I don't understand how people can believe in a God figure, to me it seems completely alien. I'm as much a product of my upbringing as someone who was brought up a Catholic and has never lapsed I suppose.

    I believe that when people die they become part of nature. Their bodies nuture the trees and worms which, in turn, feed the birds which feed my cats. This is much more comforting to me than wondering whether they are sitting on a cloud playing a harp or burning in a fiery pit.

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  • Flowery the Grouch
    Beginner December 2007
    Flowery the Grouch ·
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    I don't have any faith or religion, and am quite happy about it. I never have had. My parents aren't religious in the slightest, and it has just never been a part of my life.

    As a child I was sent to Sunday school, but only because my mum's friend was very religious, and it gave my parents a free sunday morning ?. Both my primary schools were CofE (small, village parish schools, so no other sensible option) so i grew up with religion at school - prayers and hymns at assembly every day, harvest festivals, christingles, nativities etc but despite all that I have never felt in the slightest bit religious. I do like a good hymn/carol though ?

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  • H
    Hickory ·
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    I was christened (Protestant), MrH was brought up as a Catholic (and went to a Catholic school). I can't remember when I realised that I didn't believe in God, or any religion at all, but I was young, udner 10. It wasn't a lightning bolt moment but just a realisation that none of this seemed true to me.

    I know some people take comfort in religion, especially when someone close to them dies, but I take more comfort in the thought that this is it. We have our chance now, to love our friends and family, to make ourselves and others as happy as we can be. I try never to complain about the 'bad things' that happen to me (being made redundant etc) as I know that anything I feel in life is controlled by me - my happiness, my confidence, my contentment. I'm not counting on a God for miracles, I'm not doing anything to make it into heaven, I'm not aiming for a special afterlife. That might be scary for some people but it's empowering to me.

    I get that (most) Christian principles make you a good person - to be generous, forgiving, loving and peaceful. But I hate so much of what goes with religion. I hate intolerance and coercion and I just wish that people could live the 'good' lives that they strive to live, without the trappings of God and religion.

    I joined a mentor scheme for refugees who have come to my city and need help in finding their feet and making friends. I've wanted to do this for a while (I was a mentor to care-leaver teenagers when I was at uni) and was urged on by watching How the Other Half Live. It made me realise that when things are bad, it's OUR responsibility to fix them. I want to help people and make this a great place to live, with a happy community. I get so angry at small-minded people who ruin this for everyone else, and I think religion is a big part of that.

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  • Tilly Floss
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    Yes, I'm a committed Christian

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  • Daffy B
    Daffy B ·
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    Thank you.

    I like that last paragraph, it's the circle of life. Everything becomes something else, even though life has ended your body feeds other life.

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  • R-A
    Beginner July 2008
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    I was brought up in the Quaker and Anglican traditions. My Mother is in training to be an Anglican Deacon so obviously the Church is a big part of family life, but Anglicanism does absolutely nothing for me and I don't believe in the trinity/virgin birth/salvation through Christ/creation/theistic God stuff. I like the music but that's it ?

    I have a lot more time for Quakerism. The core values of equality, non-violence, integrity and simplicity are very important to me, and I nearly always agree with Quaker 'policy' on things (latest being same sex marriage) but I no longer go to Meeting for Worship as I was unable to reconcile my lack of theistic belief with the origins of Quakerism as a denomination of Christianity and the Christian terminology used (although many other Quakers do manage this). I also find the Quaker concept of trying to see 'that of God/good in everyone' as very important (and a constant struggle tbh ?)

    I believe in the goodness of people, as well as their fallability. In that sense I am very much a humanist.

    I sometimes describe myself as an atheist or humainst Quaker as, despite not attending Meeting anymore, the core beliefs are very firmly embedded in me and still, along with humanism, form the basis of my value system.

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  • tahdah
    Beginner September 2009
    tahdah ·
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    When I was 10-18 I went to church regularly although this was not my parents doing...I sort of got sucked in (in a good way, not a brain washy way), started through guides church parade, then helping at the sunday school and took part in lots of 'church' activities. But in retrospect I think it was only because my group of friends were all part of that scene...I don't think even now I was particularly religious, I just enjoyed being a part of something. I moved to away to uni and that's where it stopped.

    I did get married in a church first time around as I thought this was the right thing to do...

    Now, I don't feel as though I have any type of religion or faith. For me it's more a case of destiny deciding on the future - 'whatever happens, happens' and that suits me fine.

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  • ashke_again
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    I'm baptised Church of Scotland (CoS) by my choice when I was 18, but after moving to Aberdeen I have not been to church regularly. In fact the last time I was at church was for my unofficial neice's christening back in March and that was a catholic service. My wedding was in November, had a CoS minister who is retired (my old minister who baptised me) and had a fairly relaxed service (was in a castle). Infact I think I've been to more catholic services than CoS in the last 5 years.

    I believe there is something greater out there but not sure where but I respect other religions/faiths/beliefs. I was brought up fairly open minded but can see where my christian beliefs came from as that's what I learnt through school, got introduced to Scripture Union at school by 2 friends (who now lead/have lead a less than what I would call christian life than what I have but that's whole other story) and it's gone from there. I'm not closed to the fact of evolution and darwinism.

    J

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  • Daffy B
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    Thank you.

    That Jehovah's witness episode would have been hilarious as a fly on the wall! I know what you mean in the last paragraph, I wish there was some sort of place where non-believers go to celebrate their non-belief, have a bit of a sing and then do good works! Maybe I should start one...

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  • Flowery the Grouch
    Beginner December 2007
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    What does make me cross is that *some* Christians (and i do only mean some, I'm trying very hard not to make sweeping statements here, some of my best friends are Christians ?) seem to think that you can't have these values without being Christian. I think the last time i got riled up about this was after a R4 thought for the day that seemed to imply that society needed Christianity in order to be kind, generous, loving etc.

    I struggle a lot with the rules and "regulations" that come with organised religion. If there was a god/creator i would find it very hard to believe that he/she/it cared whether you prayed on a sunday/saturday/tuesday, fully clothed or naked, were male or female - we invented days of the week, why would the creator care which one we worshipped on. We invented clothes, why should it matter if we are covered during worship or at other times. If the god is every-one's god then why would it matter if a man or woman lead the worship? I'm not entirely sure I am explaining myself all that well, but it's all the little nitty-gritty man-made things that organised religion has surrounded itself with, that seems like it would be totally irrelevant to the deity being worshipped.

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  • JK
    Beginner February 2007
    JK ·
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    My family were agnostic/atheist. My parents though/probably still think that Jesus was a visiting alien. We are all very interested in religion, but in an abstract way, without any faith or belief in God/Gods.

    As a child/early teen I chose to be in a C of E church choir, attending 3 times on a Sunday, and at other times in the week. As I'd not been baptised, I wasn't confirmed and before I could be, my interest waned.

    I attended Catholic Mass with the Irish girls I was at Uni with, but with no sense of there being anyone there.

    I was a committed, lone-practising, pagan from about 20 to 32, then that went west too. Science and the principle of evidence became a bigger and bigger part of what I was prepared to accept, and so any sense of a Divine force disappeared.

    I love churches, hymns and the sense of community local faith seems to provide. I'm completely in love with Rowan Williams and would be happy to sit for hours and discuss faith with him.

    Thing is, if you don't feel it, it's not going to happen for you is it? If I can't rationalise it, it won't work for me, and it's not that kind of beast.

    So, no. I don't. I'm so sorry about your brother, that must be very hard. What I'm very sure about though is that the only one in torment is you. Like my own brother (he died when I was 15), he's gone back to nature, as we all do eventually. Try not to worry ?

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  • Daffy B
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    FtG: I love a good hymn and carol, I remember a few from school and I enjoy singing them but try not to listen to the words!

    Hickory: Yes I think a lot of people take comfort in it, I think that's why when I'm going through a depressive patch I start to want to be a part of a religion. Now I try to be in the moment and enjoy everything, see the good everywhere, be good, and take every chance. Religion has its good points but it also has the coercion and the intolerance as you say. It's our responsibility to make the world a better place.

    RA: I've found myself drawn to Quakerism recently, do they actually believe in a God that has created everything? I've read up a bit on it but all Quakers seem to say slightly different things. I would like to learn more about Quakers but if a core belief is that an almighty God exists then it's not for me!

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  • P
    Beginner May 2005
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    Raised hard-core evangelical baptist.

    Turned my back on organised religion around age 15 as I found it all too cultish.

    "Rediscovered" my faith aged about 30, this time in a more moderate CofE setting.

    I still struggle to recognise my scientific side with my spiritual one, and question my beliefs almost daily. I don't think this makes me a bad christian.

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  • H
    Hickory ·
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    I meant to add - about your brother, I'm so sorry for you. Please don't torment yourself with these thoughts though. I like to think that when you die, you're gone - in that you don't 'live on' anywhere (heaven/hell/ghost or coming back in another being) - I think though, that you're still here. In that you're in your friends and families lives, they love you and remember you and talk about you. Things that you created still exist (be it a drawing, a diary, a house or a child) and things that you told people still mean things to them.

    A weird example but I remember telling my little brother, when he was 11, and a huge fan of Nirvana's music (this would have been 1999) than Kurt Cobain was dead. He couldn't believe it (I couldn't believe he didn't know) - but because he listened to his music, read his published diary, talked to people about what an amazing person he was, he just hadn't realised he was no longer alive. And as much as you can he was dead, he certainly wasn't 'gone'.

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  • Daffy B
    Daffy B ·
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    That's fantastic I like that. I feel like we're all quite small in the grand scheme of things but can still make positive/negative changes in a big way that affects others. We're all connected. I sound proper hippy now don't I? I'm not honest ?

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  • R-A
    Beginner July 2008
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    I totally agree. And the oddest thing is that many educated, liberal Christians/Jews/Muslims will accept that other religions may all lead to the same end goal. So why bother about the little things (that become the big things) like not eating pork/beef, worshipping on the 'wrong' day, wearing the 'wrong' clothes etc?

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  • Hyacinth
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    Hyacinth ·
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    I find this interesting, as my mum is currently trying to find some kind of system, but seems completely unable to "believe" anything which doesn't have proof. She was rasied as an athiest, which my grandfather became after serving in Burma in WW2. He decided that no God would allow the things he'd seen. This was reinforced by my mum when she lost her Dad at 17 who "despite his lack of belief lived his life in a Christian way"

    Incidentally, it didn't help that my Dad is from a extremely strict Catholic background, his family where pretty much all complete cnuts, so she lost the "christians are good people" vibe too.

    There are a few bits and peices I believe in which I pull from other religions/ systems. They include Buddism (the religion I would choose if religion were mandatory) the serenity prayer (God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference) and random things, like "If" by Runyard Kipling. I just cling onto things which make sense, from people wiser than I. Maybe I should combine it into a new religion, like L Ron hubbard ?

    I've always had a secret desire to be Jewish though. I think its just to have a really great Friday and a mama to make me chicken soup.

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  • R-A
    Beginner July 2008
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    It's certainly not obligatory to believe in a creationist God to be a Quaker. Thereare athesist Quakers, Buddhist Quakers, Hindu Quakers etc. It's rather difficult to explain but there aren't the same core beliefs as with other organised religions, apart from the values of peace, truth (or integrity), equality and simplicity.

    Nice introductory website here http://www.quakerweek.org.uk/intro/

    Good page: http://www.quakerweek.org.uk/intro/quaker-beliefs

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  • Daffy B
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    FtG: I think I heard that particular thought for the day as well and felt the same. Some Christians and members of other religions seem to feel that if you're not religious, you're not a good person. Well I'm sorry but I'm not a thief, murderer, liar etc etc and I have no faith.

    I agree with you as well that if there is a God, surely he's not going to care what we wear? Or if a gay person marries another gay person, or whether we pray in a church or in the back seat of a car.

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  • L
    Lucky Moonshine ·
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    Sorry to hear about your brother ?

    I suppose i would say im an Atheist, i've been christened (CofE) but apart from that (and weddings etc) i honestly don't think i've ever been in a church. My family are christians although again dont go to church etc, except for my grans brother who does and regularly gives sermons (is that the correct word). Religion was never really talked about when i was growing up, i guess the majority of it was learnt at school.

    I do believe however that there is "something" after death, (at least i'd like to think so) although im not too sure what it is/would be, so i guess i'll have to wait ?

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  • Hyacinth
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    Hyacinth ·
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    RA I didn't know that, I'm just reading that site now. How interesting. Am I right in thinking quakers are the people who run the friends cafes in hospitals?

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  • Zebra
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    Yes, I find that comforting too.

    Hickory, I completely agree with the niggly stuff that faiths build up around them. I think that Jesus probably said a lot of good stuff and did a good thing trying to point people back to simplicity but that the Christian churches have just returned to the same love of rules and regulations and thrills and judgements that Jesus overturned.

    I find the Society of Friends (Quakers) ethos very appealing because they ask you to make your mind up on your own experiences and pause for thought rather than stand up sit down repeat this and so on that I grew up with in the Anglican faith - so distracting from the actual point of thinking/worshiping God. I also like that they look to show their faith rather than preach to others about it - this country would be much poorer socially without Quakers, when you see what they achieved with regard to employment, prisons, education....

    I love going to Quaker Meeting but I have pretty much lost any sense of faith in a greater being so it's not something I have pursued further.

    OP - Quakers are part of the Christian church formally and most believe in a God of some sort but there's no creed to define what God is. If you go to a Meeting, you'd be very welcome and might get a better idea. I'm sorry to hear about your brother's death, it must be very hard to carry with you. ?

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  • Zebra
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    Don't think they are linked now but might have been in the past.

    Quakers have done lots of voluntary work though - Oxfam and Amnesty International were both set up by Quakers.

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  • R-A
    Beginner July 2008
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    Nope the friends' cafes are run by the 'Friends' of that particular hospital (ie local charity group).

    Confusing, as Quakers are often called Friends ('the Society of Friends').

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  • Hyacinth
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    Oh I see. I have to say its a relgion I really know nothing about, but its sounds very "comforting"

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  • Daffy B
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    Thanks Hickory, he died seven years ago and sometimes it feels like yesterday and sometimes it feels like seven years. I don't think about this a lot because I know that there is no way of knowing and it's pointless tormenting myself, but when I'm feeling down it pops up. Most of the time logically I believe that when we die life ends, there is nothing afterwards, and he is therefore at peace and lives on in our memories.

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  • Merlini
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    Brought up Catholic (I from an Irish-Italian family, difficult to get more Catholic than that). Went to mass every Sunday until I left home at 18. Lost faith gradually - all gone by the time I was 23 or so. Am 33 now. I miss some things about the church - I liked going to mass, I liked the singing, the hymns, the art (especially in continental Catholic churches). Don't miss the rules and regulations and am horrified now by the attitude of the Catholic Church to many things.

    I find the stardust idea comforting and, like many others, find beauty and inspiration in nature and science. The only philosophy I subscribe to these days is "Be excellent to one another and party on, dude" (copyright Bill & Ted).

    Daffy - I am so sorry about your brother. What an awful experience that must have been.

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  • Daffy B
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    RA/Zebra: thanks for the Quaker answers, I'm going to have a look at that site now.

    Thanks all for posting; it's great to hear other points of view and upbringings.

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  • Eda001
    Beginner July 2003
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    I don't believe in any set religion but I have my own belief system.

    My mum is Turkish and was born and raised in a Muslim country. My dad is a Cypriot Turk but was born and raised here. We were definately not raised as Muslims - we probably celebrated more Christian traditions then Muslim. I've got a feeling my dad doesn't believe any of it but my mum does even though she does not practice it apart from occasional prayers. I've noticed as she's got older she's got a bit more into it and sometimes has a go at me for not knowing anything about Islam (eg. not knowing prayers, when religious holidays are etc) but I don't see why I would with the way I was raised.

    However, I do have my own beliefs. I believe in life after death but not in a heaven/hell way. I had a bit of a spiritual experience when my uncle died which led me to believe this. In Turkey, a lot of people have family plots at cemeteries. We went on a holiday there very shortly after my uncle passed away and we went to visit his grave. He was buried alongside my grandfather. I remember the cemetery being absolutely beautiful - full of the most amazing colourful flowers. It was so peaceful which is amazing considering it is in the middle of a hectic city. My mum was so upset and crying (he died from cancer and my mum couldn't get to Istanbul in time to say goodbye) when the two most incredible butterflies landed on the graves - one on my grandads and one on my uncles. They stayed there for a few minutes and then flew off twirling around each other up into the sky until we could no longer see them. My mum said it was a sign that they were together and in peace and I actually agreed with her. Before that point I didn't believe in anything but after that I felt that a persons soul does go on somewhere else. Hope that story didn't sound too lame, it just meant a lot to me.

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  • CBear
    Beginner April 2009
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    I was Christened but never taken to church by parents. I went to a school with it's own chapel and weekly services, but I was sent there for it's academic record, not it's religious base, and I wouldn't call it a religious school, it was founded as a Christian school, but had a massively diverse population, the chapel services were just tradition, and you could opt out of it.

    Anyway, I digress. As a teenager I did briefly flirt with the idea of Christianity, but then I did a history A Level focussing on the Reformation era, and it struck me that 500 years ago wars were fought over what to tell people to believe. That wa it for me and organised religion.

    I have major issues with the Church (Catholic, C of E both), and I also have major issues with other major religious institutions (especially Islam) because of a lot of the doctrine. I have no issue with faith, purely with an institution of men controlling people's faith. I have major issues that most (not all) major religions tell me I will burn in hell because of my sexuality, but that I will be "forgiven" of I repent my "sin". Excuse me????!

    But I would never judge anybody who follows any religion. I will judge them on their attitudes and how they treat their fellow humans.

    I believe in something, but not sure what. Lately I think I do believe is some sort of power, but maybe it's the power of nature, which in itself is amazing.

    Humanism really appeals to me, they basically say that when people do good things, it's down to the people, not some mythincal God, and when things are bad, it's also down to people, even when people aren't at fault it's the responsibility of people to make it right (that is a such and over-simplification, please forgive me!)

    My one issue that I do worry about is death. In terms of my body, I know that goes back to nature, and I like that, it's a cycle. But in terms of the person, I don't understand how somebody can just stop existing. Our personality is not made of flesh and bones, it's far more abstract. I just can't see how it would stop. That's the one thing that "scares" me if that's the right word.

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